[BTicino/OpenWebNet] Adding CEN commands: design

espresso · February 17, 2020, 1:16pm

Hello,

I have a Bticino MyHomeServer1 (v 2.30.10) which I managed to connect to it from Openhab (v2.5) via OpenWebNet (v 2.5.0.M3). I have discovered by things, created my items (Lights, Shutters, Thermostat, Dimmers, Powerplugs) and configured my sitemap.
I have now reached the scenarios part, with the aim to control my 3rd party security items (door sensors, motion senors etc), simply by launching a scenario from MyHomeServer1.
As a background my MyHomeServer1 has an application MyHomeUp (v 2.7.6) where you can create scenes (aka scenarios or rules), assign these scenes to physical keys, or launch them form the application MyHomeUp.

I have read the full thread, haven’t seen anyone with MyHomeServer1.
Long story short, I created a scene from MyHomeUp, assigned it to a physical key. After pressing the key I was able to discover it and it was detected as CEN+ (note this is the only way to discover scenes. The issue i have have tens and tens of scenes and I cannot (and do not have the ability) to assign each scene a physical key).

I was able to create a test rule to both trigger an external action after the scenario is activated from the physical key, and to trigger the scenario itself from an external event. I am able as well to trigger the scenario from PaperUI.

What is not working, is when I trigger the scenario from MyHomeUp application. Nothing is being logged (log is in Debug).
Moreover, I have Alexa integration with MyHomeServer1, the moment I add any scene, Alexa immediately detects and I am able to active it via voice. I would imagine in this case there is a way to identify these “soft” scenes.

Why am I not able to see all my scenes on openhab and how can I have them triggered from the Mobile app MyHomeUp?

Thank you

m4rk · February 17, 2020, 1:57pm

I think I had a similar situation as you with MH202 scenario controller. CEN commands sent via scenario controller do not make it out onto the BUS. It makes some sense I suppose as the scenario controller expects it is the only one with the scenarios to execute and nothing else on the BUS; so the CEN/CEN+ do not get sent externally from the controller.

So, I made a workaround that works very well. I used unused BUS addresses to send an ON command to a non-existent, virtual switch, but is an openHAB only item. The command gets sent via the BUS when a scenario runs and then openHAB binding detects it via the virtual switch ON command. openHAB can then run a rule, voice announcement or whatever when the MH202 scenario runs.

In my case I use it to detect when a blind scenario has been run and update a string item to show what the blinds are supposed to be doing … eg blinds are fully open, blinds are in sun protection mode, blind are in storm protection mode etc.

example rule

rule 'Wind protection'
when
    Item WindProtection_VirtualSwitch changed to ON
then
    logInfo("Blinds",'Open -  windy')
    BlindPosition.postUpdate('Open - windy')
    BlindPositionChange_Timestamp.postUpdate(new DateTimeType)
end

M

espresso · February 17, 2020, 2:37pm

Hi Mark,
Thank you for your quick reply :).
I am not sure about MH202, you can trigger a scenario from a MobileApp of it’s own?

Moreover, I think MyHomeServer1 is a bit different, there is no concept of addresses in that sense,
you run a discovery and it will detect items on the BUS. Moreover, in MyHomeServer1 everything is integrated, the scenario module, the webserver, the controller etc.

I have a few questions on the “So, I made a workaround that works very well. I used unused BUS addresses to send an ON command to a non-existent, virtual switch, but is an openHAB only item. The command gets sent via the BUS when a scenario runs and then openHAB binding detects it via the virtual switch ON command. openHAB can then run a rule, voice announcement or whatever when the MH202 scenario runs”

Here you are saying since MH202 is a separate scenario controller, the scenarios triggered from it were not sent to the BUS (which run i assume on a different piece of device?)
You went on the bus controller and used a free addresses (doubt i can do the same), but here what is not clear, how did you trigger it? From MH202 in your case? how is that different from point 1 where you run your scenarios “EN commands sent via scenario controller do not make it out onto the BUS.” Or does this BUS has it’s own scenario as well?

I am trying to put the puzzle together.

What i do not get is why nothing is showing on the BUS in my case when triggered from the mobile while there is actually action taking place.

Thank you

m4rk · February 17, 2020, 3:30pm

Hi,
Yes I can trigger scenarios directly from my phone app. These are seen in the openHAB log as BUS commands ‘who 25’

1 My BUS scenarios are all located and run on my MH202 scenario controller. A trigger for a MH202 scenario can be many things including phone CEN commands and CEN commands from other running scenarios on the MH202. It is CEN commands initiated by the scenario controller itself that do not get sent on the BUS. I have many scenarios that trigger other scenarios, like subroutines, and openHAB doesn’t know whena scenario was triggered if it was triggered directly from the MH202 scenario controller itself.

2 A scenario on the MH202 can do many actions eg initiate more scenarios, send commands to the BUS devices such as On and Off etc. It doesn’t matter what triggered the scenario to execute as I just include in a scenario action list a On command to a BUS device that doesn’t actually exist. The command is sent out onto the BUS and nothing happens except that openHAB detects the command being sent becuse I assigned the unused BUS address to an openHAB item specifically with the intention to detect which scenario was run. This would work for any scenario. It does not matter what triggered it.

I hope its clearer… maybe my workaround is also useful to you in your situation.

I am not familiar with the MyHomeServer1 but it must send out commands to the adressable physcial devices connected to the BUS.

edit…OK… I looked up myhomeserver1. Its just a gateway. Scenarios are created on the phone with myhomeUP. In that case you would create a scenario on the phone that sends a command to a non exsistent device for openHAB to detect. But if it doesn’t allow you to set an address to which to send the command to ie the address must be physically present and detected by the server… then you could still do it if you have some unused actuator adresses. ie there is nothing connected to some of the actuator outputs. They are unused. . I do this too

espresso · February 17, 2020, 7:30pm

@m4rk
Thank you so much for your reply, your time and your research :D.

The MH202 is far more powerful from what you said in terms of scenarios in comparison to MyHomeServer1.

" I looked up myhomeserver1. Its just a gateway" correct
“Scenarios are created on the phone with myhomeUP.” 100%.

“In that case you would create a scenario on the phone that sends a command to a non exsistent device for openHAB to detect.” I cannot chose from the MyHomeUp App an non existent device since MyHomeServer1 scans and presents only the detect devices on the bus. (note the below even with existing one it does not

"then you could still do it if you have some unused actuator adresses. ie there is nothing connected to some of the actuator outputs. " This is what i actually done, I have tested with with an available actuator linked to an available switch.

Let us say the scenario I created is to simply turn on a light and then turn it off
When I trigger it by sending the button linked to the scenario an PRESSED_EXT it works

2020-02-17 21:00:04.227 [DEBUG] [ebnet.handler.OpenWebNetThingHandler] - ==OWN:ThingHandler== handleCommand() (command=PRESSED_EXT - channel=openwebnet:bus_cenplus_scenario_control:MYHOMESERVER1_000350a4baef:24:button_2)
2020-02-17 21:00:04.672 [DEBUG] [et.handler.OpenWebNetScenarioHandler] - ==OWN:ScenarioHandler== handleChannelCommand() (command=PRESSED_EXT)

When i trigger it by by another event it (received command) it works


2020-02-17 21:00:05.853 [DEBUG] [et.handler.OpenWebNetScenarioHandler] - ==OWN:ScenarioHandler== handleMessage() for thing: openwebnet:bus_cenplus_scenario_control:MYHOMESERVER1_000350a4baef:24
2020-02-17 21:00:05.853 [DEBUG] [et.handler.OpenWebNetScenarioHandler] - ==OWN:ScenarioHandler== updateButtonState() for thing: openwebnet:bus_cenplus_scenario_control:MYHOMESERVER1_000350a4baef:24

When I go to the app and trigger the same scenario, the light turn on and off as per example but in the logs this is no mention on scenario.

2020-02-17 20:49:01.757 [INFO ] [org.openwebnet.OpenGatewayBus$a     ] - MON RECEIVED  

<<<<<<<<<<< *1*1*0412##

2020-02-17 20:49:01.758 [DEBUG] [bnet.handler.OpenWebNetBridgeHandler] - ==OWN==  ownId=1.0412
2020-02-17 20:49:01.759 [DEBUG] [et.handler.OpenWebNetLightingHandler] - ==OWN:LightingHandler== updateLightState() for thing: openwebnet:bus_on_off_switch:MYHOMESERVER1_000350a4baef:0412
2020-02-17 20:49:01.834 [INFO ] [org.openwebnet.OpenGatewayBus$a     ] - MON RECEIVED
<<<<<<<<<<< *1*0*0412##

  
2020-02-17 20:49:01.835 [DEBUG] [bnet.handler.OpenWebNetBridgeHandler] - ==OWN==  ownId=1.0412
2020-02-17 20:49:01.836 [DEBUG] [et.handler.OpenWebNetLightingHandler] - ==OWN:LightingHandler== updateLightState() for thing: openwebnet:bus_on_off_switch:MYHOMESERVER1_000350a4baef:0412

“then you could still do it if you have some unused actuator adresses” the issue is in MyHomeServer1 there is no place to set addresses, all devices identified are presented as “objects” and when creating a scenario to chose to action these devices. They identified by their IDs (serial #). Different concept I guess from the dedicated Scenario Module MH202.

Help:D?

PS having written the prior it is now clearer and I understand the logic why if I am triggering the scenario from the App, the BUS only sees the action but does not recognize the scenario. Question how can I apply your workaround on MyHomeServer1?

Thanks again Mark I know you went out of your way

Edit
Do these have anything to do with the issue?

2020-02-17 20:48:42.384 [INFO ] [penwebnet.message.OpenMessageFactory] - ##openwebnet## WHO not recongized. Frame: *#130**1*1*0*2*30*10##

2020-02-17 20:48:42.385 [DEBUG] [org.openwebnet.OpenGatewayBus       ] - ##gw-openwebnet-BUS## Malformed/Unsupported OpenMessage: *#130**1*1*0*2*30*10##

I have set a condition to the trigger the same scenario, turning on another light (this is to simulate the virtual key), the scenario works but no message on the BUS as well with reference to scenario :(…

m4rk · February 17, 2020, 7:42pm

The addresses are configured on the actuators. Either physically with configurators. These look like blade fuses with numbers them. Or the actuator addresses are configured using myHomeSuite. I guess your installer did it but is easy to do it yourself.

The app does not send the scenario frame because it would be sending it to itself. Like my situation with MH202. The app runs the scenario set up on the app and the app scenario sends out the device commands on the BUS.

Off course I could be wrong as I don’t have any experience with your app or server.

espresso · February 17, 2020, 7:54pm

Thank you @m4rk,

I’ll continue trying to figure it out.

“the addresses are configured on the actuators. Either physically with configurators. These look like blade fuses with numbers them. Or the actuator addresses are configured using myHomeSuite. I guess your installer did it but is easy to do it yourself.”
i guess you’re right issue i can only create the scenario from the app with limited functionality in that sense.

m4rk · February 17, 2020, 8:06pm

You need to post your code and log results in code fences. Button on right in the editor panel. Otherwise the formating gets messed up and its hard to read. Anyway having reread your first post I am not sure what the goal is.

Here is the frame for my office light OFF and ON

MON RECEIVED  <<<<<<<<<<< *1*0*16##
MON RECEIVED  <<<<<<<<<<< *1*1*16##

1 = who, lighting, 0/1= OFF/ON, 16 is the address. You should see something simliar either from a switch, normally point to point, or from scenario trying to switch the light on.

log:set info org.openwebnet

Is enough to see this information.

espresso · February 17, 2020, 8:58pm

Thanks Mark,
I updated the post with code fences (sorry for the inconvenience).

Anyway having reread your first post I am not sure what the goal is.

The goal is for me is to start a scenario from MyHomeUp and send a series of other actions via rules in Openhab to 3rd party devices.(for example activate/deactivate motion senors only in the garden, in the same example then the motion sensor activates to trigger a scenario on MyHomeServer1 that would send me a push notification among other actions (2 way channel))

I went back to your original suggestion for a workaround

I used unused BUS addresses to send an ON command to a non-existent, virtual switch, but is an openHAB only item. The command gets sent via the BUS when a scenario runs and then openHAB binding detects it via the virtual switch ON command. openHAB can then run a rule, voice announcement or whatever when the MH202 scenario runs.

It is clearer now for me what you are saying. The trick for me is how to create this virtual switch and be able to trigger it from the MyHomeUp app. You used i would imagine MyHome Suite to create this virtual switch?
You simply added (for example) a virtual 2 module actuator and then assigned the scenario to one button(to be able to use it as a CEN+ from openhab, a 2 way channel in that sense)? (if so I will have to do some reading to emulate what you did)

You then defined this actuator manually through your things file on Openhab and created an item for it?

Your scenario will then activate this item (either turn it on or off) that gets sent through the BUS to be read on OpenHAB (need to figure this one out, if i end up managing to create this virtual actuator will I be able to see it on MyHomeUp app to use it in a scenario and be able to send it a command (on or off)).

If you can confirm I caught the logic for me to do my homework.

Cant say thanks enough

m4rk · February 18, 2020, 12:40am

Hi,

Yes I think you are getting the gist of it. I will try to brief(ish) so as not to annoy others as I don’t think your issue is a problem of the BUS binding. Also, a caveat. I am not an expert but have learnt just enough to get my jobs done. I have no experience of your server or app. I am at risk of insulting your intelligence but here goes

I assume the scenarios created with the app actually reside on a cloud computer. Otherwise they wouldn’t run if your phone is OFF/disconneted. It doesn’t matter anyway where they are actually run from. Also, I assume your app/cloud can configure switches so that they can send a CEN command. ie the assign a CEN to a scenario app function.

I dont think you have the concept of BUS addresses and scenario controllers correct yet.
1.1 Switches can be configured either physically or virually to send commands onto the BUS
1.2 These commands can be point to point. eg an ON/OFF to a BUS address for a light actuator who 1
1.3 These switch commands could also be to a scenario controller, who 25 CEN type
1.3.1 Switches do not run scenarios themselves. They only trigger them via CEN command.

2 Actuators have an address configured either physically or virtually. They respond when receiving a command to their address eg switch relay output ON/OFF

3 Scenario controllers hold and run the code for a sequence of events and triggers >> scenarios
3.1 Scenarios are triggered by real events and also by the CEN command (who25)
3.2 CEN commands can be sent either from a switch, button push, another scenario, phone app, or openHAB.
3.3 Scenarios run a sequence of commands. eg ON/OFF and or send CEN commands
3.4 CEN commands initiated by a scenario controller are not sent onto the BUS as it expects it is the only secenario controller in the system and therefore no need/undesireable to send it onto the BUS.

So, your goal is to get a signal out to openHAB when a specific scenario is run so that openHAB rules can then be used. BUT …you can’t use a CEN command if its initiated from the scenario controller itself because it not sent via the BUS. openHAB can only detect a CEN command if a switch sent it.

To get a signal to openHAB from a scenario controller when it exceturs a scenario you have the following options:
1 Scenario sends a toggle ON/OFF to non existent actuator. Virtual. Use any available address.
2 Scenario toggles ON/OFF an unused actuator. Dummy. Actuator configured with an address.
Option 2.1 … Create a sequence of ON/OFF’s specific to each scenario you want to detect is running.
Use option 1 if server allows it and you have lots of unused addresses
Use option 2 if option1 not possible. Requires an used actuator. Expensive and or not practical if you need a lot of them. In that case use option 2.1 but is probably not reliable and not nice.

openHAB detection of ON/OFF command sent to a virtual address
Create a switch item, proxy, like this on an unused address:

Switch WindProtection_VirtualSwitch "Virtual switch: Wind protection" {channel="openwebnet:bus_on_off_switch:Screen10:0815:switch"}

and an assocated rule

rule 'Wind protection'
when
    Item WindProtection_VirtualSwitch changed to ON
then
    logInfo("Blinds",'Open -  windy')
    BlindPosition.postUpdate('Open - windy')
    BlindPositionChange_Timestamp.postUpdate(new DateTimeType)
    .............whatever code you like...............
end

good luck… although not elegent I think you can do it

espresso · February 18, 2020, 7:11am

Can’t thank you enough for the help @m4rk.
Much appreciated. It is clearer definitely.
I’m off to work it out.

all the best

nepovem · April 14, 2020, 9:08pm

Hey! Sorry for bumping on some pretty old topic. I have F454, and everything seems to be working, except CEN/Scenarios.

Can someone provide some info ‘for dummies’? How should CEN be configured in MyHome Suite? I can’t find that info. I tried setting Physical/Virtual/Advanced configuration for each CEN(+), but It’s impossible to find anything in PaperUI.

I appreciate any help with that.

[WARN ] [penwebnet.message.OpenMessageFactory] - ##openwebnet## unsupported WHAT 11#0 from frame *25*11#0*11##
[WARN ] [penwebnet.message.OpenMessageFactory] - ##openwebnet## unsupported WHAT 11#0 from frame *25*11#0*11##
[WARN ] [penwebnet.message.OpenMessageFactory] - ##openwebnet## unsupported WHAT 11#0 from frame *25*11#0*12##
[WARN ] [penwebnet.message.OpenMessageFactory] - ##openwebnet## unsupported WHAT 11#0 from frame *25*11#0*12##
[WARN ] [penwebnet.message.OpenMessageFactory] - ##openwebnet## unsupported WHAT 11#0 from frame *25*11#0*13##
[WARN ] [penwebnet.message.OpenMessageFactory] - ##openwebnet## unsupported WHAT 11#0 from frame *25*11#0*13##
[WARN ] [penwebnet.message.OpenMessageFactory] - ##openwebnet## unsupported WHAT 11#0 from frame *25*11#0*14##
[WARN ] [penwebnet.message.OpenMessageFactory] - ##openwebnet## unsupported WHAT 11#0 from frame *25*11#0*14##

This is closest i came

bastler · April 15, 2020, 5:56am

hi,
do you setup in paperui or file-based (with *.things file, *. items file, …) i do everything file-based so i beleive i only can try to help there.
do you have more than one installation-niveaus (system divided with f-422)? if yes the kind of setup is a little different for cen-commands: for “where” you have to add the niveau. for example if the cen-command is 51 and the physical switch that sends it is behind f-4224 nr “2” then you have to write “51#4#02”
for cenplus this is not necessary because it works over the whole installation in all niveaus. but here you have to care about that if you want to use cenplus “51” for example you have to add a “2” so the where has to be “251”

m4rk · April 15, 2020, 6:17am

If you want it to be found in the inbox I think you need in the thing definition ‘discovery by activation = true.’ Then when the physical switch assigned to the can is used its found.

nepovem · April 15, 2020, 6:46am

For right now only through paperui. Dont know exactly what ‘niveaus’ mean. I’ve tried discovery by activation with no luck.

What U want to do - I have CEN, where short press on key 1, would turn some light ON, key OFF, and for long presses I would control the shutter. Any suggestion what to set in MyHOME SUITE, so OH2 will see that?

bastler · April 15, 2020, 9:49am

the problem is that the cen-feature is not realized very well. actually you only can trigger “beginn_press”, “extended-press” and “released” - but they do not work as they do if you trigger them in mh202 for example.
i had similar wish like you, but the binging recognizes the cen not as expected and so im afraid your function will not be possible to realize here.
short example:
if you want to trigger light (short press) and shutter (long press) this cannot be realized here because the binding does not trigger a “short-press” but a “begin-press” - so if you do a “long-press” for controlling your shutter the binding will always send the “begin-press” - what will cause your light to switch.

you can use the cen/cenplus only very basic in oh. all scenes that only need a 'begin-press" are possilbe.

if you have f-422 in your installation you will have different niveaus. i use niveau “1” for groundfloor, niveau “2” for upper floor.

nepovem · April 15, 2020, 11:27am

Hm no other workaround? CEN is becoming useless this way.

m4rk · April 15, 2020, 1:14pm

Maybe I do not understand your issue correctly but I have CEN working from OH sitemap. I also have OH detect when a CEn was run on the BUS from my scenario controller using virtual switches as part of the scenario

nepovem · April 15, 2020, 1:56pm

This is great, but this only works for ‘short press’ than, cant add more scenarios that way I think

m4rk · April 15, 2020, 5:30pm

You could get an extended press using Alexa voice command and the mode controller tag. Maybe button mapping in site map too.