[Z-Wave] Reorder Flat or Replace Nodes

I have huge proplems to include AND exclude devices (for testing).

my repertoir contains 40 Devices. This time I want to make it a little bit more orded and I want to start (after a controller and device reset) with the powered once (to use max. mash repeators)

I have installed z-way next to openhab and can switch between them stopping/starting services.

But some of them still hand during the interview and did not complete. (OpenHAB include)
Here my first question: Is the result of the Interview saved in software or controller?
So I retried the interview in z-way and nearly all are ok.

But one [1,2,3,4,5,6,7,8,9,10,11,12,13] was failing.
So I tried tried the “Replac” this (select 11) node inside z-way
UI show that it is in inclusion mode but the red LED (which is normally on during include/exlude) stays off?
After reloading the page (mistake?) the 11 was gone and I tried to include it within z-way (without success)

I went back to OpenHab and tried to include it there, but it appears as #14 and even with a corrupted name (not full interviewed)

So how can I fill the place @Node 11 with a new device (or some that is allready includes like #13 ?

And how do I generally exlude a device easily? (with any software)
In my case ever 20. test to exclude works but I get no visuell response:
Even harder I believe that include/exclude is the same procedere and maybee when I press 3-9 times on the device I will exclude and immediately include it again??

I dont want to continue as long I have such issues inside my list (#11 , #14) :sneezing_face:

Is there any tool to reorder my nodes? In this case I could include all and clean up every dissmissed later.
In generall I do not find any nice dokumentation which bringt me the quintessence what is saven in software and what on the controller. What can be changed/refreshed? What can be backupped?

I like the devices (when they are inclueded) but fear of ghost-nodes dives me into insanity. :ghost: :alien:

AFAIK, there is no way to reorder nodes directly. If you want to get rid of nodes this is not really working reliably from openHAB. I have put together as much as information how to deal and work with z-wave networks which may help you: [SOLVED] Unresponsive Z-Wave Network: Tools and Approaches to track down the issues

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I didn’t check now if the information is part of what stefan.hoehn put together. If yes, you may take it as a confirmation:
The node ID itself is stored in the controller. As far as I know the controller will assign IDs up to 242 (or something around there) before it starts to fill unused ID numbers (freed up by excluding the devices that were assigned to that number at an earlier point in time).
Everything beyond the ID is stored either on the device itself or in the controlling software like OH.

So I guess there should be a procedure to “fix” any node-information after knowing its Node-ID?
Lets say I used the same Controller but another software (like the one from brand; in my case z-way)
include a device (than you said, controller and OpenHAB only knows ID)
What are next stepts to get it working all around (in OpenHAB 3.x)?

I noticed (only when initialized in OP) that there will be a button with “reininitialize”. But when Interview is not done fully (most of the time I only realize that there are 20/23 or 22/23 properties) this button also is not available.

So what are the steps in generall (maybee need another topic?)
and what are they called in OpenHAB (sorry to say, but namings are not the poster child of this great project)

Ok :thinking:

See Chris’ answer here: Z-Wave-Network: What happens when node numbers increase > 232/255? - #2 by chris

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A long time ago I spent a bit of time thinking about the node IDs and the fact the IDs were not in sequence due to a few experiments and missing know-how. But I decided to leave it as it is as I did not want to waste a lot of time for just having IDs in sequence. They are, after all, just IDs. In OH I work with the thing names, not the node IDs (exception are the items definition and the channels they represent, working with files, not UI). That’s my decision, yours may look different.

It is important to distinguish between the two steps of 1) “inclusion” of a Z-Wave device into the network (this is the step where the node ID is determined) and 2) its configuration afterwards as a thing in OH (where the controller asks the device for its data like vendor etc. and compares that against the local database to define the available channels if there is a match).

I did not test this, but from what I know it should basically work if you really want to invest the time for it. But be aware you do it on your own risk :wink: :

  • exclude everything from the controller
  • reset the controller to factory settings to ensure it assigns node IDs starting with the lowest number (as that seems to be one of your goals)
  • include all your devices in the sequence you want

You may do this with the software of your choice, z-way might be better suited than OH.

When all inclusions are done, switch over to OH and scan for Z-Wave devices. They should popup in your Inbox so you can define Things for them.

Edit: This procedure should work for all devices that are NOT included with secure data transmission. Or you need to find out how to transfer the encryption key from the system used for inclusion to OH as it is not stored on the controller.

As far as I know this concerns only the second part within OH, provided the inclusion process was successful.
If the interview part does not finish, you may want to create DEBUG logs for that process to find out why it gets stuck.

Do a backup and edit the hex in the backup with a hex editor. What you do is set the greatest node used to 232. If you then restore it will fill gaps but not sure it is worth it.

get a zniffer and you will see what is happening so you do not make this mistake

nice said, but such device is about 100 Bugs :frowning:

UZB-3 is $36 so a little exaggeration

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