Zwave - Mysterious Self-TurnON....big Questionmark

Hi, I have an Openhab Installation running for some years now, recently I have strange behaviour in that some (not all) switches turn ON randomly.

As an example: No rules are triggered and suddenly some of the switches turn ON at the same time, Its a random time like 18:06 today or 19:05 yesterday. I run out of ideas what could be the reason for this behavior. Had never seen this before, have not changed anything recently. I’m running a Odroid U3 installation with Zwave USB Stick as controller.

My only guess that I have right now if a ALL-Nodes ON message is sent on the zwave channel…but here I could not understand why only part of the switches follow this, as some are still turned off. Or maybe not all of them react to such signal…But still, if this is the reason, where does it come from.

Its rather annoying as i have no trust in my installation right now as its somehow self organized and does behave little unclear to me. Regards Norbert

You say you have been running on an Odroid for some years now. Have you been using the same SD card all this time? Weird and inexplicable behavior like this can sometimes be attributed to a failing SD card.

I admit this feels unlikely in this case but it is something to consider.

Beyond that I’d put the zwave log in debug, wait for it to happen again and see what the controller and binding are doing at that time.

I used to see this behavior, too, and it took me some time to figure out why.
Once upon a day, all of a sudden about half of all my lights started blinking for no apparent reason.
Turned out it was a multisensor configured to have a tamper alarm that sent an ALL-ON alarm.
We had garden works ongoing that apparently shattered earth so heavily that it triggered the sensor.

Check parameters on all of your zwave devices:
Check all your SENSORS if and when they do send alarms and where.
Check the actuators how they are configured to react to alarms.
From Fibaro devices, I know that some are configured to react to ALL-ON and some are not in their default config. Probably the same with other vendors. That’s why not all switches react.
As an ALL-ON is (or can be) a broadcast, the initiating device(s) can send directly to everybody via air, i.e. without relaying through the controller, so in effect, you wouldn’t even see these messages in your debug log.

I would suggest to get a logfile to see if anything is being sent, and if so what it is. It might not show anything if the problem is coming from another sensor like Markus suggests, but it would tell you if something in OH is initiating the problem.

Thanks a lot, SD its hard to believe as i changed systems several times within these years…about 3 months ago i switched to Jessie, so still could be but i myself also more have the feeling its some sensor/…that forces part of my switches to react to such ALL ON message…will check and debug today evening.

But still, hard times to understand why it started now and not does this behavior from the beginning…will keep you posted. Thanks a lot Norbert

As I understand it, your zwave network should not be affected by a new neighbour bringing their own zwave setup, but … ?

A tamper alarm going wonky after a few years is not unreasonable

Each frame has a “unique” home ID - I think this is 24 bits, so that’s a 1 chance in 16 million that 2 controllers will have the same ID and would therefore cause problems. It’s not impossible, but pretty unlikely.

Hello all,
I now waited for a few days to observe if it comes again…last time the All-On came daily but since I turned off the controller (Jessie + Zwave Stick) and started completely currentless…

since that time no issues seen anymore…my believe is that its inlikely that the controller usb stick ran into some kind of strange behavior sending ON messages without request…and by removing current it got reset…

Any ideas if this is a realistic scenario…for myself hard to believe …

Did you by chance try just a few devices to remove / repair before going to a full system rebuild? I have a couple of lights exhibiting a similar behavior where they are triggering at random times (middle of the night I definitely notice) and there is nothing in the log or events file showing any commands sent to them. I don’t want to do a full system rebuild so wanted to see if you had any luck with a partial before I start messing around.

Edit: @chris

I wanted to see if you had any thoughts on this. I’m seeing really weird behavior in the event.log where the switch changes to a 50 value, my rules change it to a different value and then the switch tries to force itself back to 50 again? I don’t see anything in the standard debug logs and haven’t ran a detailed log over an extended period to try to figure out what is triggering it. Here is the event log (the command is my rule to change the dimmer value to 45):

2017-06-25 23:14:57.694 [ItemStateChangedEvent     ] - Light_SF_MasterBath_NorthSink changed from 0 to 50
2017-06-25 23:14:57.727 [ItemCommandEvent          ] - Item 'Light_SF_MasterBath_NorthSink' received command 45
2017-06-25 23:14:57.735 [ItemStateChangedEvent     ] - Light_SF_MasterBath_NorthSink changed from 50 to 45
2017-06-25 23:14:58.699 [ItemStateChangedEvent     ] - Light_SF_MasterBath_NorthSink changed from 45 to 50

Not really - I don’t think it’s likely to be a binding issue. You say that there’s nothing in the logs, so again, this would tend to indicate that it’s not a zwave binding issue.

The event log doesn’t help since it doesn’t show what in the system changed the value (binding, rules, etc)…

If you can show some issue in the zwave debug logs then I’m happy to take a look of course.

Thanks Chris, likewise I couldn’t find any sign of what was triggering it but didn’t run a detailed debug log. I restarted OH last night and haven’t seen it occur for the last 12 hours. If it does, I’ll put it in full debug mode to try to narrow it down.