Best hardware platform

Hardware Server
163

i also switched to VM ubuntu , i am still using my old windows run till it dies
but, i am trying to import all the VM now
i agree the ability to change hardware , it the most important thing for me
as i am doing this only for hunbby its nice to find old pc and run OH on it

164

I have thought about this solution. I have a few old laptops laying around, (Lenovo W520Ā“s with Intel i7s). My main headache is, how to get from my Rpi, with InfluxDB and grafana running, to this laptop without starting all over. There are probably solutions out there, but I fear itĀ“s timekilling options.
Also IĀ“m using an zigbee Rpi shield, which obvious wont be ported. But since this is just a test case for zigbee, itĀ“s not that important.

165

Iā€™m sure that would be a welcome addition to the options available for getting started with OH. Can we expect you to create and make available a VM image and a PR to the Docs to describe how to do it?

Personally, I donā€™t think running OH as a server in a type 2 hypervisor is a great approach for most users, but Iā€™m sure it is a fantastic approach for some users. Given that OH runs on pretty much OS that will also run Java I donā€™t really see what it buys you by adding the additional complexity of running OH in a VM when you can run it natively on the host OS.

But the biggest issues for many/most home automation users to use a VM include:

  • They donā€™t have a server machine they have running all the time upon which to host such a VM and shelling out $100 (much less if you already have SD cards and charging cables and donā€™t need a case) for a complete RPi setup is a lot easier to afford than $150-$300 for a Nuc.

  • The are energy conscious and want any always on machine to use a little power as feasible.

  • Markusā€™s previously mentioned additional complexities and problems that arise with interfacing hardware with the OH VM.

That isnā€™t to say Iā€™m against VMs. I personally run OH in Docker container on a VM on a type 1 hypervisor.

Iā€™m not even against someone building and offering a VM preconfigured with OH. More options == better. But I would hesitate to recommend that solution to any user who doesnā€™t already have the skills necessary to set one up on their own.

Shouldnā€™t be too hard really assuming you are running a Debian based Linux on the other machines/virtual machines.

I run in Docker, InfluxDB, and Grafana in Docker so pretty much every time I upgrade anything Iā€™m migrating to a new OS.

166

My migration from RPi to VM was pretty simple using the details provided by Riko - the laptops you have knocking about are quite beefy for the requirement, so youā€™re in the fortunate position of being able to test any of the scenarios that I presented.
Iā€™d have been ok staying with the RPi if I wasnā€™t having performance issues - Iā€™ve defitneitly seen more stability on the VM (and before you ask - yes I tried both suggested java versions)
It may well be the stability was due to to the rebuild - Iā€™ll never know - good luck whichever way you go - there is no wrong solution

167

Hmm sounds really simple. And yes itĀ“s a Debian on on of my W520 laptops.
Maybe I should try one of these days. Thanks Rich!

168

I cant really say anything bad about the Rpi IĀ“m running atmā€¦ Except, itĀ“s an Rpi, itĀ“s running Linux, and I simply donĀ“t get Linux. This means, every time there is a problem of somekind, IĀ“m forced to spend alot of time trying to figure out, whats going on and how to fix it.
But just to make sure IĀ“m not running into performance issues, I guess it would be better to change platform in time. If I first get performance issues, I would probably hav spend alot of exstra time trying to solved these problems, before I even noticed it was a performance issue.
Another reason for chaning platform (hardware though). Because I can :slight_smile:

169

Reviving a bit here -
I bought one of these


I had a spare 60GB mstata disk laying around so worth a punt.

Just played with it so far, not moved it into the production.
Read and write gets you around 50-60MB/s (usb cap) spikes and sustained 40MB/s. SD card was, IIRC, 20MB/s.

Something improved io and an over clocked rpi-static-ip-address might make it a better good little server.

170

Mind the context: this is about HW to run openHAB. A properly optimized OH setup does neither require fast I/O nor a fast CPU so it runs well on a stock RPi. Any deviation from that ā€˜mainstreamā€™ comes at a price, literally but also in terms of knowledge required.
If your stock Rpi does not work well enough, thatā€™s a hint you should change your rules and/or handling (e.g. donā€™t edit rules in place).

171

True. Iā€™m currently running mqtt and mysql on different servers (jails in freenas). I want to consolidate them into one hence my need.

Youā€™re right though, the RPi 3B+ is doing very well.

172

Nothing wrong with that setup, why not keep it.
Additional mosquitto on RPi doesnā€™t do harm, you could also move mysql to your RPi but mount the data dir off the NAS so you wonā€™t need any SSD for that.

173

Hello there!
What do you think, would it be good having OH system on this hardwer?

Model: BBen MN9 Mini PC
-OS: Windows 10
-CPU: Intel Cherry Trail X5-Z8350 Quad Core (1.44-1.92GHz, support dual frequency)
-GPU: Intel Gen8 HD Graphics
-Memory: DDR3L-1333 4GB
-Storage: eMMC 64GB
-Micro SD card: TF card slot, Max. 128GB supported
-WiFi: 802.11 a/b/g/n/ac,2.4GHZ / 5GHZ
-BT: Bluetooth V4.0
-I/O Interface: TF card slot1+USB3.0 port1+USB2.0 port*1+MIC USB *1
ā€‹-Power: AC 100~240V, 50/60Hzļ¼Œ5V/3A
ā€‹-Fan: Internal Mute fan

It costs like $126. I would also use it for browsing on the net, dl-ing / watching films etc, but nothing serious. Would connect it to a smart TV. It has Android though, that i like, but for some things itā€™s not quite comfortable. So this PC would be a two in one.

Thank you, regards
Peter

174

Install linux instead
More support

and no problem for:

1 Like
175

Yep. Makes sense. With legal win 10 costed ~$15 more. Couldnā€™t resist the temptation. I thought if itā€™s gonna be slow i still can change to linux. I havenā€™t used it, but wouldnā€™t mind.

176

I switched from a Pi to an Intel NUC and openHAB runs like a dream. The Pi was good for building the system but the NUC is rock solid and I havenā€™t looked back. I run it on Ubuntu and Docker.

1 Like
177

I have recently done the same as Hammar. I should have done this such a long time ago. Easily done for < $200.

This proves a point that the RPI are just for development. Once my OpenHab became more production I should have switched. A nuc is several orders of magnitude faster.

178

My Pi was OK but I love my NUCā€¦ a very happy upgrade.

179

I am new to OH, but Iā€™ve had a Pi 2 based irrigation controller for many years. For those who have experienced issues with the SD card becoming corrupt from time to time, I found that using a low power UPS to power the Pi (one that actively regulates voltage output) solves that problem completely. The Pi is simply very sensitive to voltage.

Iā€™m in the process of setting up a HP Mini 210 netbook with Ubuntu Server 18.04 as a dedicated platform for serving OH. The netbook has an Intel Atom dual core CPU in it - weā€™ll see how it goes.

180

This statement isnā€™t right and dangerous.
It is true that power losses during writes may crash a card so a UPS is a good idea, but thereā€™s also SD corruption due to frequent writes which has nothing to do with the power supply.

181

SD card corruption caused by an inferior quality part is a different problem.

If youā€™re trying to achieve long term durability of your SD card it would behoove you to purchase a good quality one. I donā€™t think I have anything fancier than a 32GB Sandisk part and itā€™s been running for 5 years continuously with no corruption. It uses the OpenSprinkler Pi project which datalogs to it everyday. I have a 0.5 acre property with multiple zones including citrus, palm, and vegetables - Iā€™ve achieved a level of reliability with the system that allows me to go weeks, if not months, unattended.

Also, the issue with SD card corruption as it relates to the power supply to the Pi is mainly caused by brown-outs - not complete power loss. While I canā€™t say that Iā€™ve not seen SD card corruption due to a bad power loss situation, itā€™s the low voltage level that may precede the event thatā€™s usually the culprit.

182

A typical OH install with persistence enabled makes orders of magnitude more writes per hour than OpenSprinkler makes in a whole day. The two platforms are simply not comparable from that perspective. As with everything YMMV. But letā€™s do a back of the envelope calculation based on my considerable experience helping users on this forum.

Letā€™s say we have 500 Items.
250 of those have restoreOnStartup
20 of those are charted

Now letā€™s say we have an average change/command rate of once per 10 minutes per Item. Some will be far greater, some will be much less.

OK, now letā€™s look at logs. If you finely tune your openhab.log file we can assume a pretty low rate, letā€™s say one write per 10 minutes.

events.log writes all events on Items except updates. So this means that every change and every command to any Item generates a write. In addition, updates and events from Things also generate a write to events.log.

So if we put it all together we have:

500 events.log + 1 openhab.log + 250 restoreOnStartup + 20 charts = 771 writes per 10 minutes = 111,024 writes per day

And I low balled these estimates for number of writes. I suspect the average user sees a lot more than this.

And this doesnā€™t include logs and writes from other services like Mosquitto or Grafana which can be significant in their own right.

At these rates, even a good quality SD card can start to show the signs of wearing out after a year or so, depending on the size of the card, how it does wear leveling, supported number of writes, etc. A 32 GB Sandisk running something that writes as little as OpenSprinkler I would expect to last almost forever. But for something that writes as much as a typical OH install, only a couple of years on a card like this wouldnā€™t be unexpected.

I will agree that most of the time when we help people on this forum with SD card corruption problems, it most likely is caused by power problems. But we canā€™t know that so we usually have to recommend replacement of the SD card. But that doesnā€™t mean it doesnā€™t happen and I agree with Markus, saying that just using a battery backup power will fix all SD card corruption problems is a dangerous recommendation because it isnā€™t true. More than once Iā€™ve seen reports of SD cards that have gone corrupt even with battery backup and it always turns out the SD card is small (8-16 GB) and/or their system has a pretty large number of writes per day.