DeviSmart is not z-wave. And to my surprise protocols are different indeed. However at a glance they are related and share the same basic flow.
It looks to me like DeviSmart version is scaled down in order to fit into limited resources of the thermostat hardware. LivingConnect is a more advanced system with many devices and a single big controller box.
In contrast, DeviSmart is just a thermostat. You can have several of them, but there is no interaction between them. You only control them via app; they have some rudimentary zoning, but it is all managed by the app in software.
So DeviSmart protocol is custom binary, with simple message structure and no heavy lifting like protobuf and proper SSL
The thread title is incorrect then.
Perhaps. Let me explain.
The thread was originally started by Living Connect owner. LivingConnect is a complete solution; it consists of some devices and a controller box. Devices connect to the box, apparently by proprietary z-wave. The box connects to the Internet and can be controlled by a smartphone app. A typical turnkey smarthome package. I would expect devices themselves to be pretty dumb, with majority of control logic being implemented by the box.
So, if we want to throw the box away and talk to devices directly, that would be z-wave. If we want to talk to the box and use it as a gateway, this is not z-wave.
This thread in fact discusses option number two.
DeviSmart is a related product in a sense that it also uses Trifork cloud and it uses similar protocol, but not the same. I guess LC uses full-featured SSL (i conclude it from this thread). DS uses a reworked version of CurveCP (http://curvecp.org), with the same crypto procedures but different packet format. I’ll publish my prototype code for that afrer i pass the initial handshake.
That is useful information omitted from the first post. It was written indicating they were just an interested (potential?) user with no knowledge of the protocol used.
My concern is that any Z-Wave related binding integrate with the official one, or at least, not interfere.
I’ve actually read the first post now. 
Apparently there was earlier version of Danfoss hardware, branded LC-13, which was open, and OH could talk to it using Z-Wave. But the newer product line, the LivingConnect™, works only with the supplied controller.
Apparently they decided to force-sell the complete system with the controller rather than sensor kit.
And, i guess, the thread slowly drifted away to discussion of how to work with the controller rather than individual hardware items.
At this point it stops being z-wave binding and starts being LivingConnect™ binding.
Personally i have googled out this thread somewhere in the middle by searching information on “mdglib”, the core communications library, used by Danfoss.
Hello, readers! I have made some progress with mdglib reverse engineering, my library works and successfully connects to DeviReg thermostat. I have looked at Christian’s LivingConnect sources and i see that it uses the same grid servers as DeviSmart does. So, the library should work with both products.
Developers are strongly wanted to help me in different areas.
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Interesting that grid servers apparently support also normal SSL, used by the LUA code. I guess in order to connect to a LivingConnect box we need normal SSL, because the box most likely supports only one protocol.
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hello,
i just got a danfoss thermostat living connect z lc13 and im trying to add it in my network but it seems to be impossible. i have openhabian 2.4.0-1 installed on a rpi 3 and i have different zwave devices installed around the place.
i found the thermostat in the discovery tab an added to the thing list. when i create items from channels using visual studio code every thing is going out, i cant access nor the sitemap or the basic ui which says “It seems like you have not defined any sitemaps yet. To build one, please check the documentation for guidance.” if i delete items and sitemap related to thermostat everything works fine.
do i do something wrong or this thermostat is not working anymore with openhab?
ps: i use aeon labs gen 5 as a communicator and i read some posts here that some of the users with same config managed to add this thing, others couldn’t. i tried already to delete it from the network several times, to addit back or to reset the thermostat according to the manual but no success yet.
any answer kindly appreciated.
Are you sure that the device is compatible with the ZWave system? This particular thread is talking about the Living Connect system which is not compatible with ZWave and requires a special binding. Danfoss apparently decided to make their devices proprietary and incompatible with ZWave. If you have one of these versions of device, then you presumably require this special binding and not the ZWave binding.
If you do have a ZWave compatible version, then you might want to ask this question on another thread so it’s clear.
hi, thanks for the answer. this is what openhab detects: Z-Wave Node 012: LC-13 Living Connect Z Thermostat
how can i know which one is which? what version it is? it says living connect so it means its the one that is not compatible with zwave binding? what about this “z” on the end of its name? and why i can discover it on paper ui?
im confused…
Yep - me too. I don’t have any of these devices, so unfortunately can’t answer the question. Possibly the XML file that OH creates might indicate if the standard command classes are used as I assume that the Danfoss specific devices don’t support the standard classes and only support the proprietary class and some of the standard management classes (but that’s a guess).
as a remark: when i create items from channels i get 4 items:
Number:Temperature ZWaveNode012LC13LivingConnectZThermostatThermostatSetpointHeating "Setpoint (heating)" {channel="zwave:device:1503f015:node12:thermostat_setpoint_heating"} Number ZWaveNode012LC13LivingConnectZThermostatBatteryLevel "Battery level" {channel="zwave:device:1503f015:node12:battery-level"} Number ZWaveNode012LC13LivingConnectZThermostatTimeOffset "Clock time offset" {channel="zwave:device:1503f015:node12:time_offset"} Switch ZWaveNode012LC13LivingConnectZThermostatAlarmGeneral "Alarm (general)" {channel="zwave:device:1503f015:node12:alarm_general"}
tried to add each one, one by one in the sitemap and only the last one can be added! if i try to add another item the sitemap its gone and as another remark is that if i try to add another item from another thing like a watt meter from a fibaro relay the sitemap reacts the same, it disappears! maybe its something wrong in the sitemap file?
The answer if it is supported by Z-Wave or not, is not clear yes or no…
A little history…
When Danfoss introduced the Living Connect Thermostats athermostat could be paired to either the Danfoss controller or a Z-Wave controller, at some point you should choose which way you wanted to go:
- Propetary Danfoss
- ZWave
I think in the beginning the difference was in the firmware on the thermostats.
As far as I know the LC-13 is the Z-Wave version, I don’t know if the early ones also was LC13. As far as I remember one of the problems was that it both supported Danfoss as well as Z-Wave (I actually think that it is the same thermostat under the hood)
Now a days there is a clear difference between the Danfoss thermostat propiertary thermostats and the Z-Wave version. The firmware is completely different, allthough they both rely on Z-Wave.
If you have a newer LC13 (last 2-3 years), it is no doubt that it is a Z-Wave version (and only that).
The older ones has some problems as far as I know.
I have the danfoss living connect lc13 installed already on my heat device, on the discovery in oh I found it and I was able to make items from Chanels as I said above.
I don’t understand if it is Zwave it has to work with any zwave controller, right? I also tested the connection of this danfoss following the manual and it seems to communicate with the network!
Moreover there is something strange with the sitemap, I can’t add some of the existing items like for example the watt or kwt of one of the fibaro relays (on the sitemap I use only the switch without any other items.
I don’t want to repeat myself here but I want you to get the point, this thermostat has 4 items like above and if I try to add 3 of them on the site map file on the paper ui the site map don’t appear. The last item can be added and the site map can be accessed! Why is that? What does this mean? Do I have the right thermostat or not?
Still confused 
Since you have LC13 it ought to be the Z-Wave version and thus it should be able to conenct with any Z-Wave controller. AFAIK the older (first) versions of the Thermostats had some “firmware issues”, I have never worked with it so I can’t tell you what it is. You can check manufacturing date and Firmware version. It is located in the battery housing (at in the none Z-Wave version)
BTW. This thread is about the Danfoss Link system, and thus it has nothing to do with the LC-13 Thermostat (besides from the Thermostats looking identical).
I have seen quite a few comments on people having trouble with the LC-13, don’t know if Danfoss is offering firmware updates.
EDIT: I just checked a danish site, which states that wheeter it is working has a lot to do with the Firmware on the Thermostat.
The versions reported to work is:
014G0002 with the old firmware 2.06 ( 3.02 / 3.04 / 4.02 does ONLY work with Danfoss Link system)
014G0012 with firmware 2.50 / 2.51 / 1.00
014G0012 / 13 with firmware 2.50 / 2.51 / 1.00 / 1.01
014G0013 with Fw 1.01
So it highly depends on your Thermostat and firmware if it works or not.
Thank you for searching info about this and I’m sorry if I’m on the wrong post, I’ve checked the thermostat and it is this year in January and the firmware has to be sw1.01
I called on the phone the Danfoss guy in this area and he said that if it’s zwave it has to work with all zwave devices and he never heard about the modified zwave protocol. However he will said he will check if there is any info about this.
So the thermostat is living connect Z with sw1.01 firmware I guess and it is produced in Denmark.
PS: another new behavior that I noticed trying to include this is that now on the paper ui discovery there are 3 new thermostat things related to the same thermostat like node011, node012 and node 013 but if I add them as things non of them works and they block the site app.
The number 014xxxx is important, as this says something about the hardware. If you search the internet you will find some discussions about the compatibility. The version that supports Z-Wave is about double price as the one that support Danfoss protocol. The problem is that most sellers claims that it is Z-Wave, even those that won’t work with any thing else than the Danfoss Link Panel.
Depending on where you bought it they might not know what they are selling. Shops selling homeautomation tends to know what they are selling, where other shops doesn’t.
That does not sound good, maybe you having now some ghost devices from deleting and excluding aso …
You did not show us your sitemap entries.
Mine are:
Setpoint item=ThermostatDanfoss_WG label="Wintergarten SOLL [%.1f °C]" minValue=5 maxValue=28 step=0.5
Default item=BatterieDanfoss_WG label="Heizkörper WG [%.1f %%]" icon="batterylevel"
The corresponding item entry is:
Number:Temperature ThermostatDanfoss_WG "Danfoss HK WG [%.1f °C]" {channel="zwave:device:Razberry2:node2:thermostat_setpoint_heating"}
Number BatterieDanfoss_WG "Batterie HK WG [%.1f %%]" {channel="zwave:device:Razberry2:node2:battery-level"}
Maybe you could show us your items and sitemap content, for me it seems your LC-13 is included successful.
The thermostat was bought from a company who sells only thermostats but this company has nothing to do with home automation and i spoke on the phone with the guy who represents Danfoss in this area.
my items created with visual studio code:
Number:Temperature ZWaveNode011LC13LivingConnectZThermostatThermostatSetpointHeating "Setpoint (heating)" {channel="zwave:device:1503f015:node11:thermostat_setpoint_heating"}
Number ZWaveNode011LC13LivingConnectZThermostatBatteryLevel "Battery level" {channel="zwave:device:1503f015:node11:battery-level"}
Number ZWaveNode011LC13LivingConnectZThermostatTimeOffset "Clock time offset" {channel="zwave:device:1503f015:node11:time_offset"}
Switch ZWaveNode011LC13LivingConnectZThermostatAlarmGeneral "Alarm (general)" {channel="zwave:device:1503f015:node11:alarm_general"}
sitemap:
Frame label="Termostat" {
Number:Temperature item=ZWaveNode011LC13LivingConnectZThermostatThermostatSetpointHeating
Number item=ZWaveNode011LC13LivingConnectZThermostatBatteryLevel
Number item= ZWaveNode011LC13LivingConnectZThermostatTimeOffset
Switch item=ZWaveNode011LC13LivingConnectZThermostatAlarmGeneral
}
only the last item is accepted and the site map can be displayed.
At least in Denmark the versions of the Thermostats sold in companies that does not sell HomeAutomation is selling the Danfoss Link version. It is significant cheaper than the Z-Wave (in Denmark). Allthough it is sold as Z-Wave, the only Z-Wave about those thermostats is it it is based on Z-Wave technology (eg. frequency). The firmware on the Thermostats is NOT Z-Wave compliant, and will only work with Danfoss controllers.
When I bought my Danfoss Thermostats I read about all the problems with support for Z-Wave and went for the Danfoss Link version.
My guess is that youy either have a defective unit or is it a Danfoss Link compatible unit.