Newbies


(Vincent Regaud) #1

More like about 40 a day and more in the week-ends.

Some posts don’t get answered because there is a lack of information in the original question and if the OP is not bothered providing info then why should other bother…
Some post don’t get answered because a quick search on the forum or the docs would have provided an answer straight away. (I personally am tired of responding to a post with a link I found within 5 seconds)
Some posts don’t get answered because the person(s) that normally help on this topic are not here today and this is where we need more people helping. Even if you are not an expert, if you think you know the answer or where to find the answer then please help. Thanks


Opinions for full blown automation solution
(Mark) #2

My wife thinks this is my full time job. LOL


(YvesHanoulle) #3

there is a lack of information in the original question and if the OP is not bothered providing info Then why should other bother…

Because communities only grow if the people in the communities help new members learn and teach new members the rules of the community.

I personally am tired of responding to a post with a link I found within 5 seconds
I think you overestimate how new members can find stuff that you know how to find.


(Vincent Regaud) #4

No I don’t. There is a big magnifying glass right at the top of the forum page to look for thing. If one type in the title of their new post in there instead of creating a new post there is a good change that an answer will be there. I am all for helping people but people need to help themselves too.

I can’t come up with an example right now but opening a new tab on the browser and typing a google search about ESP8266 mqtt tutorial will point you in the right direction. And it took me 5 seconds.

And I am all for that. And I ask new member post about more details if they omitted then in their original post. I am talking about users who should know better.
But most new users don’t bother filling the system info that’s required. Most new users don’t follow the forum tutorials. Some new users come in here and just ask for ready made code for their use case.
I’ll help, and I help, every day, everyone I can. But help yourself first.


(YvesHanoulle) #5

No I don’t. There is a big magnifying glass right at the top of the forum page to look for thing. If one type in the title of their new post in there instead of creating a new post there is a good change that an answer will be there. I am all for helping people but people need to help themselves too.

this shows you do over estimate it
I regurly search for stuff that I don’t find, only to get an answer you can find this here and here, with links I dont’ find when I search.


(YvesHanoulle) #6

I can’t come up with an example right now but opening a new tab on the browser and typing a google search about ESP8266 mqtt tutorial will point you in the right direction. And it took me 5 seconds.

it takes 5 seconds if you know the correct words how to search, which newbies don’t know


(YvesHanoulle) #7

But most new users don’t bother filling the system info that’s required.

Half of the stuff that is asked, I don’t know the answer to and I’m using openhab for +3 years now.


(Vincent Regaud) #8

Then create a new post, that’s fine

Granted, 2 minutes then

Fill in what you know

But a question like “My sensor in not working” (We get these) doesn’t help


(YvesHanoulle) #9

Granted, 2 minutes then
I litterly mean newbies can’t find that. not in 5 seconds, not in 2 minutes, not in an hour or a day.


(YvesHanoulle) #10

Fill in what you know
But a question like “My sensor in not working” (We get these) doesn’t help

I know it’s not enough information.
and yes I read all the questions I know there are many with not enough info,

when I know the subject, I start by asking the question to ask for the info that is needed (or that I think is needed)
it’s the only way to teach people. And re-teach over and over.
ignoring these people or being rude, drives them away and that does not help grow a larger community with more people answering questions.
Growing a community goes very very slow.
this is a community that is great when you know your stuff, we are not so great to newbies.


(Vincent Regaud) #11

I agree with all that. Wholeheartedly. New members are always welcome and I do try to help as much as I can within my limited knowledge. I agree that sometimes we assume too much of the newbie knowledge. But then we backtrack and go back to basics. But I don’t want to spend my time in the forum going over information that in the docs or the tutorials and a lot of newbies get referred to those which they should have read in the first place.


(YvesHanoulle) #12

But I don’t want to spend my time in the forum going over information

That’s not what I’m saying, linking to the tutorials is enough.

that in the docs or the tutorials and a lot of newbies get referred to those which they should have read in the first place.

again if they find them. Newbies have no idea what’s out there. just like when developers are new to a team, it takes at least 6 months to know what the rest of the team knows.

every week I’m learning of tutorials that I had no idea that existed and that I don’t find when I look for them.
it’s only because people mention them in the forums (on my or others people questions) I discover them. I know there are tutorials and yet I don’t seem to find them when I need them.


(Vincent Regaud) #13

(Mark) #14

I don’t mind the posts that lack information. I’m pretty analytical, so my posts tend to have lots of detail. OTOH, I realize that not everyone is like me. (And thank goodness for that!).

It helps to level set sometimes… Occasionally (on this forum and others) I’ll look at some of my early posts, and think ‘holy cow was I dumb back then’.


(YvesHanoulle) #15

I’ll look at some of my early posts, and think ‘holy cow was I dumb back then’.

I consider that a good thing. If I don’t feel like that about the things I did 3 or 6 months ago, that means I haven’t learned anything.


(Mark) #16

BTW, thanks for making this a PM. I was starting to think we were getting a little off-topic. LOL


(YvesHanoulle) #17

[vzorglub] why make this a personal message?
I think it’s a very important topics that both newbies and experts can learn from (me included)


(Mark) #18

Probably because the OP would start thinking that we hijacked his post.


(Vincent Regaud) #19

I moved this to a personal message topic

@yves, I agree
Newbies need more help and to get more help they need better docs and more helpers on the forum
The docs are getting better and If a newbies followed and read the beginners tutorials from start to finish they would come to the forum with better questions
There are also more Helpers on the forum and more are coming all the time because this is such a great community that people want to give back.
We were all newbies at one point. And we are giving back. this is what’s it’s all about.
But we stuck to it. We did all we could to solve our problems ourselves first without asking a question in the forum at the first hurdle. I didn’t even know there was a forum until about 6 months in and by that time I had solved my problems one by one by reading the docs again and again and again. And that was with early 1.8 openHAB with the old wiki.
On my first post in here I got a quite terse answer because I didn’t search the forum first and the answer was already there. I remember feeling foolish about that.

Because some of the comments are a bit derogatory…


(YvesHanoulle) #20

A new post I get
a personal message I don’t get, now no-one can see this discussion.

What is OP?