I am surprising why KNX is not famous with some colleagues. KNX is the most common bus system and it is reliable and works for years. It is wired system and the connection as:
Power cables pulled from power-DB into Control-DB and connected to KNX module (for light, A/C, …) then to field devices (lighting fixtures, FCU, Blinds)
All interfaces (push buttons, sensors,…) connected by the knx cable (two wires) using looping way.
Such this system was the only way, with other systems including PLC.
Recently wireless equipment becomes more famous, and can they came for finished house as it is hard to pull cables, but for under-construction houses many people (and I am one of them) prefer the wired medium.
KNX waited too long to enter the North American market (2015ish). By the time they did they had competition from old stalwarts like X10 which don’t require special wiring, and wireless competetion from Zigbee and Zwave. It’s more expensive and requires running new wires. It just can’t compete in this market so it is pretty rare and hard to get.
If their only competition were X10, they probably would have sold a chance, but even then probably not because pretty much all houses here are wired with lights and outlets in series. To support a bus type system the entire house would have to be rewired which is not feasible.
There are not enough people who prefer wired to make it viable in the home market.
Just for another data point: I’ve been using Lutron Pico remotes. They require a separate bridge (I had a used Smart Bridge Pro already and turned on its telnet interface to use with OpenHAB), but the individual switches are inexpensive ($15 USD at the local home store), have long battery lives, and come in a few button configurations with relatively tasteful wall and “pedestal” mounts. Low latency, too, and the buttons give you separate “down” and “up” events.
Did you try these buttons Vitrum; as it mentioned they have two series (Z-wave, KNX). However, the contact link shows email without details about the company!
A late addition, I would recommend not to use ZWave push buttons (or ZigBee or KNX or whatever tech, for what’s it worth) but to decompose the task:
Get a (ZWave or other) device with binary or analog input(s) and put them inside your walls, then attach your favorite switch(es) and mount them on top.
Switches by themselves are technology agnostic so this will give you many more choices and (eventually) better pricing than if you go for a fixed combination.
I, for instance, deployed switches from the series I have been using in my house anyway.
As @rlkoshak wrote you can use any OH supported generic input device. In some cases such as dimming it might work better to stay within a technology though, so if your loads are ZWave, I’d stick with ZWave inputs. Another advantage of this is that switching loads/lights will keep working when OH is down.
On ZWave devices, you can use the Fibaro FGD series’ 2nd input as a scene input that is not associated with any load (light or other) in the first place, or you can use any FGS without attaching a load. Enabling ‘scene’ functionality allows for distinguishing different types of button presses (single/double/triple click, press-and-hold).
Likewise, there’s the FGRGBW-441 which is a RGBW LED actuator but also comes with 4x 0-10V inputs. These you can use to directly control the output channels but also as standalone inputs.
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MDAR
(Stuart Hanlon, UK importer of Velbus hardware)
32
If button events are the only thing that is required, then that’s a great suggestion.
There is a universal Velbus module that provides that functionality.
I’m currently looking for ‘nice’ wall switches to integrate for a refurb of my kitchen.
I’m liking the look of the Velbus glass panels with multiple pages etc.
I literally only want the glass panel, so was looking at that plus the usb module. Can the glass panel have items linked from openhab or only other Velbus items?
So for instance page 1, would have on/off for 4 Phillips hue groups, page 2 could be used to activate 4 different scenes, and page 3 to display some strings (energy use) from openhab.
Couldn’t find much on this so any advice welcome.
1 Like
MDAR
(Stuart Hanlon, UK importer of Velbus hardware)
34
Hi Dave
Absolutely you can do this.
You’ll get full access to all the button events, which includes the HVAC thermostat feature.
The feedback LEDs (even the Edge Lit lights are in development) can be controlled by openHAB2.
So for example ;
A Velbus button event can switch on a Non-Velbus device, via an openHAB2 rule. (I believe this is referred to as “Protocol Translation”)
openHAB2 will set the Feedback LEDs in accordance with the device status (assuming the rules are in place), so that if the device is switched off / on by another means, the feedback LED remains accurate.
Fairly simple rules can dictate the action dependant on other device status’, so toggling a status, or incrementing (brightness / volume etc) until a button is released is fairly easy. (Incrementing / decrementing is easier with NodeRed flows)
You’ll also be able to use the Velbus button events that can be triggers by the timers inside each panel, which makes scheduling even easier, as you can adjust any of the 4 independent timers (in each Velbus Input device) from openHAB2.
Wake1
Bed1
Wake2
Bed2
Each timer can trigger events -
Before, At or After each set time.
Every day
Weekdays
Weekends
Weekly
Monthly
Yearly
As for the Memo Text feature.
Yes, you can set Page 3 to display the Memo Text content. (Screensaver will always show the Memo Text)
So you could, use the 4 buttons on page 3 (for example) to manipulate the Memo Text content. (Max 64 characters)
(Reset / clear by sending a blank Memo Text command)
If you buy a number of Oled panels, I’ll throw in a VMB1RYNOS so that you can easily access some of the advanced features of Velbus glass panels that aren’t yet directly supported in openHAB2.
You’re the first non-commercial person to go down this route, but you’ll be glad to hear that there are a number of commercial installers who ONLY take this route.
Feel free to ask for any information or advice, I’m always willing to assist.
FYI,
As an example, I’ve got an Oled panel in my house which controls many DMX chases and other devices.
With a simple NodeRed flow, I can scroll through a series of scenes from a single button, or selection of buttons from different panels.
(With a Long press action set to switch off everything)
(I have similar DSL rules, but I find NodeRed flows easier to create & Debug)
Thanks for the fast and detailed response.
I thought it would be the case but I couldn’t find concrete clarification and without already owning it’s not like I could test.
1 Like
MDAR
(Stuart Hanlon, UK importer of Velbus hardware)
36
You’re very welcome
If you want to test further, without buying any hardware, I can give you the connection details for a Velbus demo rig I have here.
You’ll just need the latest Velbus binding and setup a Network bridge.
Pull this update script and run it on your Linux machine.
Or look at it to see where it pulls the binding jar from
Sorry couple of other bits:
What size backbox is required
How far does the panel protrude from the wall?
MDAR
(Stuart Hanlon, UK importer of Velbus hardware)
38
Excellent questions
Ideally, I like people to install 50mm deep, 67mm diameter round back boxes.
40mm deep is acceptable, just slightly less room inside.
Depending on the ID of square UK boxes, 40mm deep single boxes are okay, but they require a 2mm adapter plate to support the blue mounting frames.
Assuming you’re using round back boxes, the panels stand proud of the wall by 12.35mm.
If…
You don’t want to use the thermostat functionality AND you’re extremely careful, it is possible to rebate the back box and open up a square aperture to accept most of the glass panel, leaving 3.2mm proud.
Likewise, you could make a slightly bigger aperture and fit the panel flush.
BUT…
If you take either of these options, YOU’LL NEVER get the panels out again, without risking delaminating the front face.
MDAR
(Stuart Hanlon, UK importer of Velbus hardware)
39
I’ve purchased a 3D printer and come up with a better way of supporting the Blue frames in UK boxes, by effectively giving them support from the base of the box.
These are a work in progress, but easy enough to adapt for different back box designs,
But it´s not just its size which is causing problems. They screw holes in the adaptor are useless as they gets to close to the wall box. It will not fasten good enough this close. The devices which is normally used in these boxes are screewed inside of the box… But thats not going to work for the Velbus (and probably everything else in EU standard size) as they need the space inside…
I´ll try to find a better way to show the dimensions… Alternative I´ll send you some of these damn boxes or deliver them personally, (has been a while since my last trip to the UK anyway)
1 Like
MDAR
(Stuart Hanlon, UK importer of Velbus hardware)
45
These two options are probably best.
I’ve got a pair of rooms you can stay in if you’re in the area
I’m not entirely sure which way round this should go…
I understand your confusion…
The wall box on the picture would is place regarding of from where the cables/pipes are come. The actual picture show cable/pipe connection from the side. Normally they would come from upside or downside, and then the wall box should be rotatet 90 degree (either way).
This is a one gang wall box (1-module). They´re available in 1½ gang as well. And they can be fitted together as well (thats the small tap on the outside center)… The width is the same in both wall boxes.
Inside (which you cant see due to the red plate which will be removed after the wall box has been fitted, before mounting any devices), there are two screw plates for screw mounting, or the devices can be fasten with “graping hands” (I dont know the english word), just like the white fitting, which arrived with the Velbus OLED panel I received…
I have found a youtube movie showing how to place mount a outlet socket (with button) in a 1½ gang wall box… There you can see the screewplates as well as the “graping hands” on the outlet socket. Look closely from time 1:47
